Curse

Golganneth · Aug 26, 2008, 09:49 PM // 21:49

I'm trying to make a decision between making a Mesmer or an Ele. I'd like to do a lot of burst damage while still being able to have a good flexible amount of builds for different areas. I've played Warrior and Assassin and would like more of a caster role now.

My primary goal is to do the regular - HM & Title farming. I'm mainly going to be doing these as H/H, since I can't really deal with PUGs too much

. Thanks in advance for any input.

Tyla · Aug 26, 2008, 09:56 PM // 21:56

Mesmers are kind of weak in PvE, but if you like the role of shutdown you might aswell make one. It also offers Cry of Pain without having to lose your secondary, making room for Assassin's Promise. Since you can just use Mind Wrack and slap Cry of Pain on your bar, though, it's usable on other professions. The hex doesn't matter at all because you won't need shutdown because you're spiking, and in PvE Monks aren't as spot on as in PvP.

Elementalists have a wide array of support, infinite energy and can Monk for itself with ER, or even do anything caster based. The only problem is enchant removal highly screws up the ER Monk, or whatever.

I myself would choose the Mesmer, but in overall effectiveness I would go with the Elementalist. I just personally like the Mesmer's main playstyle.

Oh, and if you happen to decide to go to a PuG, a Mesmer is also a bit of a downfall point as people don't realise PvE is easy and CoP is also sexy.

arch psyker · Aug 26, 2008, 09:59 PM // 21:59

Ele is a good damage dealer. Fire is good for AoE damage. Air is good spike damage to single targets. Earth is good for knockdowns, AoE, and wards. Water is good for slowing targets.

Mes is good for energy denial and interrupts.

I've played more ele then mes, sorry for the less detailed breakdown on the mes side. A good mesmer can be a deciding point in any battle though.

Bobby2 · Aug 26, 2008, 10:39 PM // 22:39

Ele: awesome mob control, raw power
Mes (not counting Cry): key target disruption/punishment

Ele wins out on versatility, Mes on coolness

Damus · Aug 26, 2008, 11:04 PM // 23:04

mesmers are great at interrupts and shutdowns, but mind you in HM, where mobs casts twice as fast and twice as quickly, interrupting will be near impossible and shutdowns not as effective, whereas damage will always be damage.

Lishy · Aug 27, 2008, 01:35 AM // 01:35

Mesmers are great for punishment and armor ignoring damage. Leave interrupts to your heroes.
You have access to many many powerup combos and some fun gimmicks as a mesmer.

[Extend Conditions]
Cost: 5
Activation: 1/4
Recharge:5
Concise: Spread all conditions from target foe to all foes near your target. Those[sic] durations of those conditions are increased by 5..81% (maximum 30 seconds).

As the mesmer, your known to pressure the enemy mob. Extend conditions opens up a very powerful, effective, pressure in PvE.
The most common combo is [Technobabble] to spread an almost-unconditional daze to all enemies and then shut down the warriors with the blind skill of your choice. I like using [Steam] when I have an SF on my team. But this combo uses only 3 skill slots, leaving 5 more skills for various other supportive or offensive roles. By using this combo, it is common sense you invested a lot into inspiration. So your other skill slots should be things that do not require too much investing, PvE skills, and E-management. Like [Cry of Pain]

There are MANY other powerful effective builds of a mesmer. Such as the [Signet of Illusions] fast caster. Or the classic [Assassin's Promise] CoP Clumsiness nuker. The newly buffed [Visions of Regret] practically replaces SS and I pray it wont receive the nerf bat after it was just recently buffed.

If you want strategical hardcore play and elite areas, go mesmer.
If you are casual and want to get in a lot of PuG groups, go elementalist. Although I will warn you that fire damage is pathetic in high-end areas.

Tyla · Aug 27, 2008, 01:49 AM // 01:49

^
Signet of Illusions is a waste of a skill slot, and Fast Casting is weaker in PvE. There is also Mindbender, which gives you 100% perma-HCT and still stacks with your 40/40 mods.

No point in AP when in a Cryway group, just Mind Wrack -> Echo -> CoP -> CoP -> Dead and proceed while Cry recharges, which is very soon.

Visions of Regret is sexy, but SS is still far superior as far as I'm concerned because the AoE damage is already applied when the target attacks, strengthened by HM IAS, it works on attacks and skills, it's more spammable and permanently maintainable.

BHA or Thunderclap > Technobabble. I'd use my PvE skills on CoP, Ebon Vanguard 'Sin and EBSoH / EBSoW to buff damage for anyone in the ward or give a huge chance of halving recharge. There are several other PvE skills that I would use over it too, and they aren't the only ones.

RavagerOfDreams · Aug 27, 2008, 01:52 AM // 01:52

gonna hafta agree with Sir Bobby on this one. Necro wins true story

.....but if you have your heart set on those two I'd go ele.

upier · Aug 27, 2008, 05:37 AM // 05:37

Make the choice based on who looks better.
With 3 PvE skills and AP - your bars will pretty much be the same regardless which class you end up playing.
Both are fun - just remember - appearances might be decieving.
If you want to play a straight up nuker - you need to go mesmer.
And if you want to play a more support character - you need to go ele.

Tearz1993 · Aug 27, 2008, 05:50 AM // 05:50

Mezmar bcuz they r pertty.

-Lotus- · Aug 27, 2008, 06:05 AM // 06:05

mesmers are less effective than other primarys in PvE. thats a truth, they dont havea useful primary attribute. people still use them though, meh.

Eles are sweet. they deal decent damage in normal mode. in hard mode they are better suited to support physical characters however, as their damage spells will be affected by armor.

necros are godly, but it dosnt look like your considering them

Lishy · Aug 27, 2008, 06:39 AM // 06:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by -Lotus-

mesmers are less effective than other primarys in PvE. thats a truth, they dont havea useful primary attribute. people still use them though, meh.

Any source to back up your claims of how "useless" of a primary they are?
If they are so useless, where are all the N/Me and E/Me mesmers?

-Lotus- · Aug 27, 2008, 07:18 AM // 07:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kain Fz

Any source to back up your claims of how "useless" of a primary they are?
If they are so useless, where are all the N/Me and E/Me mesmers?

this discussion has been gone over many, many times. look for them yourself.

fast casting is simply not as useful as other caster primaries in PvE. and excessive ranks in mesmer attributes from runes do not make a huge difference like they can with Rits

JDRyder · Aug 27, 2008, 12:56 PM // 12:56

If your going to do a lot of H/H id go ele, I cant stand H/H as a mesmer, i target switch to much and the hero's just stand there like dumb asses. If you think you may get a good guild sooner or later that does shit together go mesmer, they are more useful and fun in groups of real people

@Kain Fz
-Lotus- reason for thinking FC is bad is cause SR is better for necros so this means FC is 100% useless. Hes just your average pug dont pay him any mind.

Tyla · Aug 27, 2008, 02:48 PM // 14:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kain Fz

If they are so useless, where are all the N/Me and E/Me mesmers?

[mindbender]

I wouldn't call Fast Casting useless, but I'd call it inferior to other things, but if you need it you have it in the above PvE skill. Part of the Mesmers' inferiority is their skills and what they are ment to do. Shutting down, which is done by a few seconds of daze and that's all you need. Don't get me wrong, there are a few useful skills in PvE, but mainly with the benefit of being AoE ([[cry of frustration], [[cry of pain] [[arcane conundrum], [[clumsiness], [[wandering eye]) but they don't compare to other things and don't have much of an effect in PvE. Part of this is also the fact that in a CoP group, since you're usually spiking the degen from Ether Nightmare isn't needed as the enemies will be dead within 2 seconds and you can use absolutely any hex. It doesn't matter as there are no Monks in PvE capable of stopping spikes of 800 damage (Counting Echo), so you might aswell take Mind Wrack on one guy, he pings it, everyone uses Echo -> CoP -> CoP and everything is dead regardless of primary professions, because it's an unlinked skill. The same can be said for CoF, because it's mainly for the interrupt over the damage.

Moloch Vein · Aug 27, 2008, 05:06 PM // 17:06

Fast Casting _is_ pretty much useless as a primary attribute in pve. However, one reason you take a certain class is for the combinations you are allowed.

I've often wanted my N to be a Me in order to be able to go /A with Cry and Assassin's Promise. I can't count the number of times I've wanted my N to be a P... sigh...

I would recommend you, to be blunt and ignore your OP once again, to create an N. It's the ultimate midliner caster primary for general pve. However, if it's Me vs E, I'd suggest you create a Me. The only reason I'm giving this advice is that most people who start playing E in pve get braindead.

It's possible to become a good E, who actually understands what works and does not work in terms of damage. However, it's far more likely you get run-down by the common mentality and stand there with your silly little Fireballs through the entire game, nuking your ass off while your value to the team remains weak to abysmal.

Also, that's what E in pve are "supposed to do", according to the gw and pvx lemmings. E is somehow a "strong damage class" despite getting owned in that department by just about every primary conceivable, even monks.

Note... I am generalizing horribly. However, most of what I've said is true for most people.

Laughing Bat · Aug 27, 2008, 09:28 PM // 21:28

I'd suggest ethier necromancer or mesmer, as I think playing elementalist is boring and from the sounds of it has been nerfed(I haven't played one regularly since before nightfall came out). While I think mesmer is more fun necromancer is probably the most effective(although I tend to be more effective with my mesmer. I think its just because I enjoy it more.)

As far as fast casting is concerned I'd say its the best primary. Most effective? No. Most fun? Yes! lol thats my opinion anyways. Saved my butt in gyala hatchery more then once(being able to spread multiple conditions in very little time makes keeping those damn turtles alive a lot easier.) but I can't deny that soul reaping generally means unlimitted energy in most pve situations witch means you can pretty much spam whatever the F*** you want and not have to worry about it.

Based on your op I think you'd probably like necro better then mes or ele. You can do lots of damage with stuff like ss, sv, etc.. but at the same time you have a lot of different options if you get bored such as mm, battery, orders, etc...

Age · Aug 27, 2008, 09:37 PM // 21:37

Mesmers should be some what back with one of the monks

Gonna Eat Your Baby · Aug 27, 2008, 09:56 PM // 21:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by Golganneth

I'm trying to make a decision between making a Mesmer or an Ele. I'd like to do a lot of burst damage while still being able to have a good flexible amount of builds for different areas. I've played Warrior and Assassin and would like more of a caster role now.

My primary goal is to do the regular - HM & Title farming. I'm mainly going to be doing these as H/H, since I can't really deal with PUGs too much

. Thanks in advance for any input.

getting back to the original question... the ele will be more flexible with builds for different areas for farming...... (end of response to question)

but....

if u have mainly played warrior and assassin in past, I strongly suggest u play a mesmer for a while, its fun to play, and is the best class to learn other classes skills/spells... Its a steep learning curve for mesmer, and if u play it well can really pay off.... (the 1st time I played Mes, I soon thought i should have played it when I 1st started game, it teaches u a lot about about other classes and what their weaknesses are)

Ele will be easy to farm with though

If u ever plan on pvp though, a well played Mes is always a bonus